I'm conflicted on this one. It reminds me of Jack Straw--asking women in face-to-face meetings to remove the veil. There's a balance to be struck between respect for religious practice and tolerating intolerance.

The 2004 murder of filmmaker Theo Van Gogh may have something to do with Dutch attitudes re: Islam. It shocked a lot of sensibilities, and put a face on Muslim extremism. To me, wearing a veil is a civil right.What Jack Straw did would never fly here. Unfortunately, some Muslim girls in Holland have had their faces slashed for dressing immodestly. Far more frequent is the rape of non Muslim women. I like to aim at intolerance with laser precision. I have no patience for those who fight intolerance with more intolerance. It is time the European politicians woke up to the real problem. Unless they stop the influx (immigration) of muslims into Europe the muslim population will outnumber the European population within less than 50 years. And that is the real problem. Rudi said "There are people who consider the Koran sacred who do not espouse or practice violence."

Then you are a piece of crap. You have just said you have never read the Qur'an. I have, in October 2001. After that I have HATED all journalists like you who have lied and lied about Islam, through laziness, bribes and ignorance.

Wake up, dead flesh: http://www.prophetofdoom.net/Prophet_of_Doom_Islams_Terrorist_Dogma_in_Muhammads_Own_Words.Islam There have been phases in Muslim history when Islamic governments were havens of tolerance in contrast to Christian governments that burned heretics at the stake. The opposite is the case today. I am in favour of keeping a watchful eye on those who fan violent hatred. I am not in favour of going into houses of worship and ripping pages out of their scriptures.I judge a tree by its fruit. I do not give someone a pass because they are an Islamic hate filled fanatic instead of some other variety. There are millions of Muslims who remain peaceful in their behavior. I do not believe in legislating thought and theology. There are Jew hating Christians. I will not declare war on the peaceful ones as well just because they invoke the same scripture. It is the same logic that I use with Muslims.I prefer to aim with laser precision at the haters and leave the innocent bystanders alone, be they Muslim or anything else. If this makes me "a piece of crap" then I plead guilty. Rudi said:Unfortunately, some Muslim girls in Holland have had their faces slashed for dressing immodestly. Far more frequent is the rape of non Muslim women.

But you have no patience for those who fight intolerance with intolerance? I think I'd just have to be intolerant of those maiming and raping women. These "peaceful" Muslims aren't peaceful because of unambiguous instruction in the Koran. They are peaceful in spite of it, just like Christians are peaceful in spite of their scriptures. Tolerance is a secular virtue, not a monotheistic one. Generations of secular influence have taught them to ignore the more ridiculous, demonstrably false, and hateful aspects of their holy books--or, at the very least, not to interpret them literally. I think it's a species of political correctness to keep saying that it's the extremists who stand outside the tradition.

You are right, Rudi: the decision to wear the veil, burqa, etc. should be a personal one (though I wonder--how many of these women really do choose this life for themselves). But as a secular leader, I'm under no obligation to honor traditions/practices that I think perpetuate misogyny. There's a fine line between respect and tacit endorsement, and I'm not entirely sure where to draw that line.

We forget: western women in majority Muslim countries are frequently made to accomodate these customs--customs that seem exotic, even abhorrent to their sensibilities. Why is the reverse generally not true? In fact, we continue to accomodate their traditions, even when they clash violently with our own. We can't be making all of the concessions and still keep our secular way of life. *I realize I misspelled "accommodate" (two c's, two m's--d'oh!).