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Rant

Palastine - Freedom Or Apartheid?

Posted 7 months ago|10 comments|348 views
Construction in Gilo - Occupied Teratory
Written by
Altruist
Eugene, OR
The United States is in a difficult situation now. We have been supportive of the people in their struggles for freedom in Arab Spring. And Yet.

And Yet we are supporting the very last occupied country in the world. We are supporting Apartheid, and keeping an entire nation of people in chains.

How can we, the nation that perfected Democracy, deny that freedom to others?

How can we pretend to be concerned with human rights all over the world and yet support the oppression and the colonialism of the Palastinians?

How can we be fighting three wars, all supposedly to support peace and freedom while supporting policies that are guaranteed to result in violence?

It is the US and Israel against the rest of the world.

President Mahmoud Abbas gave a pretty good speech at the UN asking the UN to recognize the Palestinian people as a Nation. http://www.palestine-pmc.com/details.asp...

Of course recognition by the UN is really meaningless. It will not give the Palestinian people the freedom they desire or the actual nation they are calling for. Only the occupying power can grant that freedom. Still it was the UN actions that created the nation of Israel in the first place. http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/opin...

Nonetheless the Palestinian people were fired up and dancing in the streets, in scenes reminiscent of Tharir square. The speech gave them hope. http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/pale...

To be fair Benjamin Netanyahu has some good points also. It is difficult to trust the democratic instincts of a country that elects Hamas, a terrorist organization, which continues to lob rockets into Israel. And Obama was correct in saying that the nation can only be brought about through negotiations.

In my opinion Israel and the US should apply the lessons of the Arab Spring to Palestine.

It is all about the people and their freedom. The Palestinian authority is deeply divided between the right wing Hamas movement and the more moderate Fatah movement. Fatah may be willing to admit the right of Israel to exist and may be willing to live in peace. They believe in democracy, they hope for peace, and the people obviously want the same. http://warsclerotic.wordpress.com/2011/0...


The lesson the world should have learned from Arab Spring is that the freedom of the people is inevitable. Peaceful protest can bring about change (as in Tunesia and Egypt) but if tyrants attempt to suppress the freedom of the people through violence and military power the people will fight back as in Lybia. It would be good if the people who now appear to be supportive of Abbas, were given some encouragement to turn away from the violence of Hamas.

The US and Israel both say that they want a two party solution. If they allow the motion for statehood to be adopted by the UN it would elevate the power of Abass, who until this speech was seen as weak and ineffectual. That would drive the people away from the right wing radicals, and the chances of a negotiated settlement would be increased.

On the other hand if Israel continues its intransigence, the Palestinian people, having their hopes crushed once again, would think that violence is the only answer, and the people would be driven to Hamas and the chances of peace would be diminished.

It shouldn't be about politics and it shouldn't be determined by AIPAC, The people of both Palestine and of Israel want peace. That should be the main consideration. http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/sep...

Israel has demonstrated that they are not interested in peace by announcing another 1100 housing units to be built in occupied territory. http://www.thestar.com/news/article/1060...
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COMMENTS
7 months ago: Altruist, change your avatar to Rod Sterling.
7 months ago: er...Rod Serling
7 months ago: And whose land shall we give to this new country?
7 months ago: We have been supportive? Or, YOU have been supportive?

Are you or yours still geting those checks from the State of California?

Who in the other 49s is supportive of the fact that Californication needs either an enima or final disposal through a septic system?

You need more of our money?

Take a long swim from your Californication coast heading west.
Altruist
Altruist
Eugene, OR
7 months ago: Whose Land? All of the parties have agreed to the pre 1967 borders with land swaps. http://www.israeltoday.co.il/tabid/178/n...

TCG By saying that We have been supportive I meant the official response of the US government. My government and yours too since Perry hasn't yet seceded. No idea what else you are going on about. Oregon invented the term Californication. I haven't received any money from California.

Despite the false perception, Obama has been very supportive of Israel, has given them more money than any other president and has vowed to veto the Palestinian attempt at recognition by the UN. http://www.theatlantic.com/international...
7 months ago: Are we talking Israel or Texas? Who attacked Israel? Was that then a WAR? What land did Israel gain by WINNING the War? Now you want to say they were not attacked from several sides. You know what. Your right. Lets just set a new guidline that allows everyone to keep what they lose even after they are agressive and attack others in the first strike of War.

Sounds very PROGRESSIVE. I'm sure you think Che Guevara was a nice guy.

Perry? Your further off the edge than I thought.
Altruist
Altruist
Eugene, OR
7 months ago: Most of the population in Palestine are young and to them the Israeli war is ancient history. They only know the oppression and the killing that is going on now. If Americans knew they would feel differently. http://www.ifamericansknew.org/

They only want peace and the ability to get a job and support their families. "If elections were held today, nearly 40 percent of young Palestinians would vote for the secular-leaning Fatah, compared with under 10 percent for its rival Hamas, a radical Islamist movement. "

Oppression and violence begets more violence. So the choice is do you favor the moderates and encourage them, or do you retaliate and drive more people to the violent extremists? http://www.haaretz.com/news/diplomacy-de...

"A recent poll conducted by the Hebrew University found that 70% of Israelis believe that if the UN votes in favour of a Palestinian state, Israel should accept the decision. This is not the position of the Israeli government." It is only the extreme right wing politicians that are the enemies of peace. In this country too. http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/sep...

Altruist
Altruist
Eugene, OR
7 months ago: TCG are you saying that your governor did Not say that Texas could secede?

Perry said: "When we came into the nation in 1845, we were a republic, we were a stand-alone nation," the governor can be heard saying. "And one of the deals was, we can leave anytime we want. So we're kind of thinking about that again."

Read more: http://www.politico.com/news/stories/081...

He said when Texas entered the union in 1845 it was with the understanding it could pull out. However, according to the Texas State Library and Archives Commission, Texas negotiated the power to divide into four additional states at some point if it wanted to but not the right to secede.
7 months ago: Is that a "Coulda, Shoulda, Woulda" question?

Is it not a fact that Texas "COULD" split if voted on by the citizens of Texas?
Out Of The Box
Out Of The Box
 Moderator
7 months ago: "Arab terrorism not only pre-dates Israeli control of the disputed territories, but also the creation of Israel itself. The car and truck bombs of Islamic extremists in today's Middle East and beyond are nothing new; a triple-truck bombing at Jerusalem's Zion Square on Feb. 22, 1948 murdered 54 Jews and wounded many others. It was organized by Abdul Khader al-Husseini at the behest of the Palestinian leader, Haj Amin al-Husseini, the Grand Mufti of Jerusalem. This was almost three months before Israel's independence, more than 19 years before Israel gained the West Bank and Gaza Strip."

http://www.sixdaywar.org/myths-and-facts...

"As early as 1920, deadly anti-Jewish riots erupted in British Mandatory Palestine. On May 1, Arab rioters in Jaffa, joined by Arab police, murdered 27 Jews and wounded 104. In August, 1929, in apparently pre-planned rioting across western Palestine, Arabs killed 133 Jews and wounded 339."


Most of the West is young, and 1967 seems very long ago. But Israel is not young, and they still remember the antagonism toward them by Egypt, Jordan, Syria and Palestine.

Why go to the 1967 borders? Is it because that's as far back as we can remember, or is it because that was when Israel was at its smallest and most vulnerable?

Modern day Israel is still but a sliver of the lands it controlled 2500 years ago, lands which were stolen by the Greeks, the Romans, and other Arab aggressors.

So when Palestine cries, "Waaaah, big ol' mean Israel won't give us back the land we stole from them in the first place." , why not tell them to quit being petulent little children, and be glad they weren't driven completely out of the Israeli lands they were occupying.

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