Health

Rant

Lives or Money?

Posted 15 months ago|30 comments|528 views
Written by
Altruist
Eugene, OR
The radical activist judges have decided that Corporations are people and that spending unlimited amounts of money to buy elections is protected as a First Amendment right. Now a bush appointed judge has decided that Big Tobacco has the right to kill off millions and that the government can't force them to put unpleasant pictures on their cigarette packages that would discourage people from smoking. Showing people the results of their using the drug violates their first amendment right to kill off people. http://www.nationaljournal.com/healthcar...

Tobacco kills six million people each year, and this is allowed mainly because profits are more important than people's lives. The tobacco companies have billions to influence lawmakers so of course no one will do anything to cut into their profits.

Most of those lives are in third world countries and we are encouraging developing countries to place the same controls on tobacco that most developed nations do. Now it seems that the activist judges want to go backwards and turn America into a third world country. http://southasia.oneworld.net/globalhead...

The government is meant to serve the corporations after all, and should just get out of the way and not bother itself with such trifles as protecting people's lives. So what will be next? Let them lie about toxic chemicals or poisons in our food? They have the right to tell any lie. That is just free speech.

But then I wonder why the government cares so much about preventing people from using Medical Marijuana? http://www.ibtimes.com/articles/155068/2...

Maybe if the Marijuana industry gave millions to lawmakers they would make it legal. Only money means anything anymore to Congress.
EMAIL|FLAG THIS POST
COMMENTS
sunny2
sunny2
15 months ago: Great post.
It is all about money.
TheLegendTomWing
TheLegendTomWing
 Administrator
Philadelphia, PA
15 months ago: I think you've missed the mark, Altruist. Pretty much everyone knows smoking is bad for you--It's taught in schools all over. But forcing a company to essentially tank themselves by putting those pictures on? I think that goes too far. Anyone can go to a library and google what it looks like. As a smoker, I don't think it's the government's job to tell me to quit, or tell me I have to see those pictures when I light up. It may be about money for them, but personally, I get enough of a guilt trip from everyone else, I don't need it from the company I buy them from.
Content Removed by Huey Newton
15 months ago: Let me start off by stating that I am not an advocate of smoking. I have seen the damage and devastation that results from that particular activity and I wish people would just cut it out.

What's amazing however, is that there are folks out there that want to post the pictures on the smokes, yet out of the other side of their mouth they want to prevent pregnant females from seeing a simple an ultrasound of their baby. What up with that?

On top, they don't want the potential mom's to even be aware of or hear of the many, many complications and problems that arise both physical, psychological and emotional from this "simple and safe" procedure. And of course as regards pictures, they never want these folks to actually see any pictures of the genocidal aftermath. That's just wrong in their book.

It's unfortunate that the government can't force them to put unpleasant pictures in their waiting rooms that would discourage folks from killing their kids.

This is allowed mainly because profits are more important than people's lives. The abortion industry has billions and are political bedfellows with and influence lawmakers so of course no one will do anything to cut into their profits.

Those folks who stand by posting pics on smokes but fight full disclosure on abortion should be seen as pretty damn hypocritical in any rational person's book
Altruist
Altruist
Eugene, OR
15 months ago: I think that an investment in discussing pictures would stop a lot of kids from trying and starting the addictive habit. That not only would save a lot of lives but it would lower the cost regular taxpayers and pay for emergency room visits and would lower insurance premiums for everyone.

If it is all about money Planned Parenthood doesn't make anything from abortions. They are non profit.

On the other hand most abortions ARE about money. If the government would spend more money on sex education, fewer women would have abortions. At least the Democrats wouldn't allow bosses to determine if female workers had access to contraceptives, so that will prevent thousands of abortions. If the Republicans wouldn't block all of the jobs programs for the unemployed more women could get jobs and have some hope of being able to support yet another unplanned child.

And as Tom said most women ARE aware that they are carrying a potential human being and it is a terrible and difficult decision and they feel bad enough as it is without being forcibly raped by some cold instrument without their permission.

Why should insurance be forced to pay for contraceptives? Because it is preventative medicine and it is far cheaper to prevent pregnancies than to pay for all of the dangerous complications associated with pregnancy. It is also much cheaper for society to prevent abortions. Are the contraceptives free for the women? Of course not. Those women are paying exorbitant insurance premiums and they should get something for their money. I thought Stephan Colbert had it right. If the lawmakers who wanted to force ultrasound were forced to have a rod shoved up their prick before they could get Viagra they would have more sympathy.

In most cases in the first trimester a picture would just show a ball of undifferentiated cells and in the first trimester you can't tell the sex or see much difference from other mammals.
15 months ago: "I think that an investment in discussing pictures would stop a lot of kids from trying and starting the addictive habit. "

I agree. But that is not what you originally stated or originally indicated as a tactic. Discussing pictures is far different than having them directly on the pack of smokes. There is no dispute there.

Nice back pedal on that one.

As for Planned Parenthood, they may be "nonprofit (wink, wink) but it is still all about the money ($$$$) and the killing of babies. Specifically the killing of babies of so-called minorities and the disenfranchised. Groups for which you claim advocacy.

http://liveaction.org/planned-parenthood...

PP has shown net Income and operating surpluses of nearly $100 million dollars. That's not chicken feed. What it happens to be is seed money to build more facilities to brainwash and kill off more undesirable groups of people. Their motivation for existence from day one has never changed. All they have done is simply added more services to attempt to legitimize their existence and cover up their stench.

As for pictures of the abortion aftermath, don't you believe those pictures should be discussed as well?

http://www.100abortionpictures.com/Abort...

How about the many horrible side effects of many of the birth control products?

http://www.morningafterpill.org/is-emerg...

http://www.yazsideeffectslawsuit.com/

Pay your own way or have your man put a rubber on it. A simple solution and no increase in insurance premiums.

It's ridiculous to mandate that companies pay for potentially life-threatening pharmaceuticals that can encourage sexual irresponsibility.

All I'm saying is fair is fair. Anything else is hypocritical. Put the pics on the smokes AND put the pics in the PP waiting rooms.

Give the women ALL the information.

You have already confessed your delusion that Margaret Sanger was a saint and that was a friend of poor black folks. However, you know full well that Sanager was a racist and a eugenicist.

That speaks volumes about where you are really coming from. You can't pull the wool over everyone's eyes here.
Out Of The Box
Out Of The Box
 Moderator
15 months ago: I agree, as a smoker. And I smoke a lot. I will agree to be exposed to disgusting photographs of late stage lung cancer, mouth cancer, etc, if you will agree to putting up pictures of aborted children in waiting rooms, counseling offices, and operating rooms at abortion clinics and PP facilities.

Throw in a few pictures of concentration camps and mass graves at Communist meetings, and I will quit smoking.
sunny2
sunny2
15 months ago: I don't think that is the point. Smoking is an addictive choice. It is a social habit. I wouldn't compare it with concentration camps and mass graves where people were herded and killed by those who were glutons for power. You mean we have to bring back sorrowful memories of hate and war torn people and countries and paste them up on a wall for you to stop smoking. Come on. That is almost like making these people relive those atrosities to make some frivolous point.
Smokers think that smoking is the most important issue to everyone because they don't like that it isn't accepted. I think people who complain care about the health of the smoker and are trying to warn them of what has happened to others and what can happen to them. Smoke away. Those people earned our respect.
15 months ago: Point taken Outta. But they will never agree to that.

They care more about potentially breathing second hand smoke than they do about the welfare of the next generation.

What's more important getting a 16 year old to not pick up a pack or getting a 16 year to keep her baby or put her up for adoption rather than having her baby murdered in the womb?

Some folks are just sick.

It's all a matter of priorities.
15 months ago: I quit at forty five, when I had trouble breathing, and has a bad pain in my chest. Many say I will not be turned off by photos.


Walt Disney. This famous animator, producer and co-founder of the corporation known as The Walt Disney Company died at the age of 65 from lung cancer, making him one of the most famous celebrities to have died from smoking.

Humphrey Bogart. This famous actor died at 57 years old from cancer of the esophagus after a 30-year career and appearing in 75 films.

Frank Sinatra. At 82 years old, this famous singer and actor died of a heart attack while also suffering from bladder cancer.

John Wayne. At 72 years old, John Wayne died of stomach cancer, making him one of the many celebrities that have died from smoking. At the time of his death, John Wayne was suffering from various other cancers as well. John Wayne once appeared in a Camel cigarette commercial.

Nat "King" Cole. This famous singer was the first African-American to host a TV show and died from lung cancer at the age of 45.

Johnny Carson. This famous talk show host died of emphysema at 79 years old. Johnny Carson was a comedian most famous for his 30-year career as the host of "The Tonight Show."

Sigmund Freud. At the age of 83, this neurologist, who founded the psychoanalytic school of psychiatry, died from cancer of the jaw.

T.S. Eliot. At 76 years old, this famous 20th century author and poet died of emphysema, making him yet another of the many celebrities that have died from smoking.

John Butler. The general manager of the San Diego Chargers football team died at age 56 from lung cancer.

Victor Crawford. This famous tobacco lobbyist became a tobacco control advocate and died at the age of 63 from lung cancer.

These are just ten out of the many celebrities that have died from smoking. Many of these people were famous for their smoking of multiple packs of cigarettes per day. There are other celebrities besides John Wayne who also appeared in various cigarette commercials and later died from one of the many diseases caused by their smoking.
sunny2
sunny2
15 months ago: A member of my family smokes 2 packs a day and said nothing will make them stop, and they resent business establishments from not allowing it but yet they say they have black lung disease. Putting black smoke in your fragile lungs isn't going to make anyone live longer. It isn't natural.
You mentioned celebrities dying at a young age, but if you watch any of the old movies, which I love, you will see they put 1 cigarette in their mouth after another, and top it off with an alcoholic beverage which they down one after another. They didn't see the threat of this causing addiction or death apparently. Then they were always together in those smoky clubs, and the second hand smoke is worse than actually smoking yourself.
They will tell us to mind our own business and give all excuses in the world that we are wrong, but they don't realize we care about them.
John Wayne you mentioned had various cancers. He was filming a movie, I believe in Vietnam, where the US was spraying Agent Orange. I was working with an x marine on a job who also was exposed to it, and he received a package of a large block of cheese. He told me that all the soldiers that were exposed to this poison were sent a package from the government. He was a marine during the Vietnam theater. Seems very strange.


TheLegendTomWing
TheLegendTomWing
 Administrator
Philadelphia, PA
15 months ago: Just an FYI, your comment on secondhand smoke is inaccurate.

http://kuneman.smokersclub.com/PASAN/Sti...

the book by the same author is worth a read and can be found on amazon if you're interested.
sunny2
sunny2
15 months ago: Whether it is or not, people die from it. It makes the lining of the lungs rigid. How can they work properly and do the job they are suppose to do? Tom, I'm open to anytning, but I can't go along with this for one thing.
My neighbor died at 62, and she was a long time smoker. She contracted emphysema. Many come down with COPD.
I've seen smokers close all the windows in their cars with children in the back seat, and they smoke away without a care that these kids are inhaling their habit.
The only other substance to me that is a killer is asbestos. We had workers spraying decorative asbestos in a building years ago before people knew about it, each one of them died. We accept that many things do harm but don't recognize what fire, smoke, and chemicals do to us. I lost two uncles from smoking. One came down with heart disease at 56 and the other was 59 years old and a Navy man who smoke and refused to stop when he was told he had to. Couldn't swallow anymore, couldn't walk because of his blood vessels constricting, couldn't talk without a device, couldn't breath. My 2 aunts were smokers and both died in their early 50s. They were pals and smoked together...brain and lung cancer. My father-in-law died at 53 he was a big smoker. His daughter was a smoker at the time and told not to smoke around him after coming out of his surgury. It didn't stop her, he was gone in 2 weeks. You are telling me I'm wrong. If you lose someone, God forbid, you will understand. I choke on 2nd hand smoke and can't breath. Any nonsmoker can't tolerate it. Why do we have to suffer for someone's habit? You have your opinion, and I'm not telling you not to smoke. Every one is free to do what they have to do.
sunny2
sunny2
15 months ago: When I was a child living in the south, how innocent and beautiful those tobacco fields looked to me. Goes to show if it brings money, it doesn't matter who lives or dies.
15 months ago: The eerie voice-over says, "Ladies and Gentlemen, the late Yul Brynner." Sure enough, the TV screen shows a close-up of that unmistakable face, bald pated, steely eyed.

Yul Brynner, who died of lung cancer at 65 last October, looks directly at the camera and says boldly, "Now that I'm gone, I tell you: Don't smoke. Whatever you do, just don't smoke." The 30-second message, courtesy of the American Cancer Society, has been running periodically on TV since Feb. 18.

Brynner, who'd begun smoking at 12, did not make his "commercial" at the behest of the Cancer Society; in fact, he had turned down such a request, preferring to take his campaign to talk shows.

Since 1983, when doctors diagnosed cancer, Brynner had spoken candidly about his failing health. That did not deter him last year from re-creating for the last time his role in The King and I.

It was at the end of an interview on Good Morning America, in January 1985, that Brynner, as if seizing the opportunity to leave a message from beyond the grave, made his statement. Says Irving Rimer, a Cancer Society spokesman, "It was right for the times, and right for the subject because it contains the truth. This man was a smoker, this man got lung cancer and died from it; and this man is telling others, 'Don't do what I did.' "

When ABC rebroadcast the statements the day Brynner died, his plea seemed even more compelling. Viewers called the Cancer Society and the network to urge using the message in an antismoking ad. The actor's widow, Kathy Lee, 28, agreed. "She had the strength and courage to say, 'Go ahead and use my husband this way,' " Rimer says, adding, "You can't do this too often. It gets too emotional."
15 months ago: This man was a smoker, this man got lung cancer and died from it; and this man is telling others.
http://www.youtube.com/v/JNjunlWUJJI&fs=...
Altruist
Altruist
Eugene, OR
15 months ago: Good comments Ed

Huey the discussing photos was a typo. I meant disgusting.

I am opposed to abortions and support education and contraceptives to prevent them. As part of a universal sex education program I would have no problem with photos of all stages of embryonic growth so women can make informed decisions.

The radical right likes to portray PP as baby killers but their main interests are the health of the women and only a tiny percentage is devoted to insuring that if a woman must have an abortion, that it is done safely so there are no complications.

I am not in favor of Big Government mandating that doctors have to force unnecessary invasive procedures on women against their will and forcing them to pay for it.

Contraceptives are not only used to prevent pregnancy and to prevent abortions from unplanned pregnancies. There are also many medical uses. http://www.youngwomenshealth.org/med-use...

15 months ago: Altruist,

I am about as radical Right as Petey Green or Malcolm X.

Planned Parenthood was birthed by killers and is kept in perpetuity by killing.

They won't even admit to their past. If they did maybe I would see their present somewhat differently.

I doubt it, but maybe.
Content Removed by Huey Newton
Out Of The Box
Out Of The Box
 Moderator
15 months ago: Nail on the head. I smoke a lot, but constantly tell my children how stupid it was for me to let myself become addicted. I explain what it is like to be an addict, and so far I have 2 adult children who will never smoke.

I wish I had the time to invest in quitting, but cigarettes have become such a major part in all my processes, I would probably need to be committed to a maximum security facility for a few months. ")
15 months ago: "I think that an investment in DISCUSSING pictures would stop a lot of kids from trying and starting the addictive habit."

"Huey the discussing photo was a typo. I meant DISGUSTING."

Altruist--

You should have stayed with what you posted typo or not. It was way more powerful made a lot more sense.
15 months ago: "Contraceptives are not only used to prevent pregnancy and to prevent abortions from unplanned pregnancies. There are also many medical uses."

More women die of the cancers that the pill causes than the cancers it prevents, so any doctor that tells a young woman the pill is a good idea for preventing certain cancers is like telling them to take a carcinogen as preventive medication.

http://breastcancer.about.com/b/2010/01/...

If a teen has acne, cramps or PMS, they really need to be led down another path than taking birth control pills. How dumb is that? Sheesh!
sunny2
sunny2
15 months ago: If you remember your high school days, who didn't smoke.
It was suppose to be very cool. Isn't it still on the increase. Apparently the people today don't care. Maybe they think if that doesn't kill them something else will. That's what I hear anyway.
sunny2
sunny2
15 months ago: I believe no matter what anyone says about pictures on one and not the other, it is about making money. If they can make loads of money through abortion, they won't show the gruesomeness of it. Most people are ignorant of the consequences and do what they want at the time. Out with the old and in with the new horrors.
sunny2
sunny2
15 months ago: Maybe a nagging wife or girlfriend will stop the cigarette smoking when a guy smokes.
If the wife doesn't smoke, the men most often can't smoke around the children, or in the house, or car. This would be enough frustration for anyone to quit.
If the husband doesn't smoke and is pretty healthy, they don't want the smell of smoke around them or in the house and make it loud and clear.
That would be enough for anyone to quit.
sunny2
sunny2
15 months ago: By the way, a chemical very similar to rocket fuel helps keep the tip of the cigarette burning . The worst is the nitrosamines with its carsenogenic properties. Chemicals are chemicals and these are bad.
http://lpi.oregonstate.edu/f-w00/nitrosa...
sunny2
sunny2
15 months ago: Did you ever think that nonsmokers are not so different than anyone else. They know the consequences and either quit, or never start. So it isn't an exclusive club where smokers are discriminated against. It is a choice by nonsmokers not to smoke and be part of that club.
Altruist
Altruist
Eugene, OR
15 months ago: Sunny good comments. I think one of the greatest tragedies is that smokers who think they have the right to kill themselves by smoking inadvertantly kill their children with the secondhand smoke.

You mentioned John Wayne and filming in Vietnam with agent orange. I heard that he and most of the filming crew got cancer because they were filming a western in a part of nevada that had fallout from all of our nuclear testing.

It isn't just asbestos and tobacco that causes cancer. As you pointed out with nitrosamines, there are thousands of other chemicals that do also, but the other biggie is radiation.

There is no safe amount of radiation and there is a direct correlation to exposure and incidence of cancer. Some people think that American tobacco products cause more cancer than tobacco from other countries because of the phosphate fertilizers used which are high in radon radiation.

The point is, that exposure to multiple things that cause cancer exponentially increase risks. We all have some radiation exposure from x-rays, cell phones, airport screenings, we all have exposure to chemicals in our meat, water, and air we breath, it is suicidal to triple or quadruple our chances of getting cancer by intentionally sucking on cancer sticks.
sunny2
sunny2
15 months ago: Al, I wasn't sure of the location it was so long ago, but I remembered his co-star came down with cancer. Not too much information on it.
There are so many chemicals out there in our food and air that we take in on a daily basis that are bad for us as you said. Today on a show. scientist were saying that there are quantities of arsenic in the soil where our food is grown. Organic foods are better to consume because of less pesticides. but they are expensive. Why do they use these fertilzers, as you had mentioned, if it can kill.
Then you have doctors giving out pain killers and drugs like candy to people that have people hooked on them and eventually can die from overdose. Cigarettes are a big deal when people don't listen to the warnings and blow smoke all over other people who don't smoke. Radiation is going to wipe us out. It's all about making money and forget the people.
15 months ago: "Contraceptives are not only used to prevent pregnancy and to prevent abortions from unplanned pregnancies. There are also many medical uses."

More women die of the cancers that the pill causes than the cancers it prevents, so any doctor that tells a young woman the pill is a good idea for preventing certain cancers is like telling them to take a carcinogen as preventive medication.
http://breastcancer.about.com/b/2010/01/...

If a teen has acne, cramps or PMS, they really need to be led down another path than taking birth control pills. How dumb is that? Sheesh!
15 months ago: I love the fact that Pro-Life ads keep popping up on this post. This is great.
jenifa
jenifa
United Arab Emirates
12 months ago: hi,nicely article

Post a Comment
Sign in or sign up to post a comment.